|
|
| Welcome to 3T! Please take the time to register and join in on the friendly,knowledgeable watch talk.Please note that not all registrations will receive an immediate activation e-mail.Those who do not receive an immediate notification will be activated manually within 48hrs. by an admin. without an e-mail activation url sent to you,you may then sign in using your username and password,if you feel there is a problem please e-mail us at timetechtalk@hotmail.com and include your name and username and we activate your account.Thank You! |
| Moderated by: 3T | ||
| Author | Post | |||||||||
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
|
YARGH 3T WIS
|
I'm want to buy a watch from a seller on WUS, but he only accepts money orders or cashiers checks. Is this normal? On Ebay, for example, most people will tell you to steer clear of sellers who only take payment this way, as it leaves the buyer with no recourse if the item never arrives. Just wondered what accepted practice was on these forums. Thanks. |
|||||||||
|
fliegerman 3T WIS 
|
YARGH wrote:I'm want to buy a watch from a seller on WUS, but he only accepts money orders or cashiers checks. Is this normal? On Ebay, for example, most people will tell you to steer clear of sellers who only take payment this way, as it leaves the buyer with no recourse if the item never arrives. I can't speak for these forums, but my 2 cents is: You're right about no recourse. But some people don't have or don't want paypal. I would say to check out the WUS member. Search his/her posts and see how they "sound". You can check how many posts they have too. If they have a lot of posts and have made other sales, they are probably ok. Just my opinon, of course. Be careful. regards, Dave |
|||||||||
|
Skipdawg 3T WIS 
|
Has to do allot with personal preference really. But I do not do anything when purchasing a item where I have no recourse. Been screwed to many times in the past in different things. So far with watches knock on wood all has been well. But when buying online I will only use a credit card or paypal. I quit using or accepting checks of any form for payment of a product in 2004. And when USPS stopped the online MO's I quit using them. Wire transfers I wont touch. If those back fire on you banks can become a royal pain. With CC or PP if things go array and either of them don't make me happy fast I will use a family lawyer to rip their legal department a brand new one that will cost them allot more than the original amount. I keep records of every little thing to the penny. CYA (cover your ass) this is a hobby but all aspects of my life I have come to find if handled like a business work out better for me. But then folk say I'm one Crazy Dawg too. LOL :cool: ;) |
|||||||||
|
teddyhanna Guest
|
How much money are you talking about $200., or less and the seller has over a 100 post and wus mems speak great about him..I would rather send a check on that note, but $500. or more "HELL NO", paypal all the way....Good Luck |
|||||||||
|
Paxman 3T WIS 
|
Unless I know the seller or know someone who will vouch for the seller I am using PayPal for my protection. |
|||||||||
|
YARGH 3T WIS
|
teddyhanna wrote: How much money are you talking about $200., or less and the seller has over a 100 post and wus mems speak great about him..I would rather send a check on that note, but $500. or more "HELL NO", paypal all the way....Good Luck It's for $400 and the guy has fewer than 10 posts on WUS, and has not made any other sales. On the other hand, he does use a full name and address as a signature block in his posts. Maybe he's just more clueless than corrupt? Maybe I should draft a sales contract. If this is his real name and address, at least I would have some legal protection. Is there any reason why a legitimate seller would not accept a COD (cash on delivery?). |
|||||||||
|
KenC Admin 
|
Bottom line: Don't touch it unless he can give you references that you have personally dealt with before! |
|||||||||
|
canadajo 3T WIS 
|
10 posts isnt enough ...mabey if he gave you a phone number and that way you could talk to him ??? Like my cousin the Paxman said ....unless you know the seller or somebody that will vouch for him , theres no way I would do it .... |
|||||||||
|
teddyhanna Guest
|
YARGH wrote: teddyhanna wrote:If you can get him to do that COD. What Ken, John, Mark, CJ and Dave are saying I concur. He has less than 10 post's and already asking for a CC or MO, has he sold to anybody that can vouch for him on any forum. Good luck in your decision. Walking away is sometimes hard to do........:XHow much money are you talking about $200., or less and the seller has over a 100 post and wus mems speak great about him..I would rather send a check on that note, but $500. or more "HELL NO", paypal all the way....Good Luck |
|||||||||
|
fliegerman 3T WIS
|
YARGH, Why not just let it go? You KNOW another watch will come along that will steal your heart  regards, Dave |
|||||||||
|
YARGH 3T WIS
|
fliegerman wrote: YARGH, Why not just let it go? You KNOW another watch will come along that will steal your heart True, but this is a watch that I was actually considering paying the new price for (nearly $1200), because I never see it offered on the forums, and now I find it available (albeit used) for $400. If everything is legit, I really stand to come out ahead here. Big "if," I know... Maybe I should ask for an even lower price. |
|||||||||
|
fliegerman 3T WIS
|
Hmmmm sounds like a good deal....who is this seller....I may have to check this out for myself! ....goofy KIDDING! Dave |
|||||||||
|
oagaspar Site Founder 
|
by the time Yargh hems and haws the watch will be sold!:D...but for what it's worth I haven't seen anyone jumping on 38mm watches lately... |
|||||||||
|
Paxman 3T WIS
|
YARGH wrote: fliegerman wrote:YARGH, Why not just let it go? You KNOW another watch will come along that will steal your heart Don't forget the old chestnut, "if it seems to good to be true; it probably is..." |
|||||||||
|
sjedwardz 3T WIS 
|
I'd stay clear of it - why is he selling a $1200 watch for $400? He could put it on ebay and no doubt make a lot more than $400. If he was a respected member with lots of posts I'd be tempted but only after extensive research. Are you willing to gamble $400 for no watch or a POS? I'm sure its not a one off watch - another will come around. I had to wait a year to find a nice Sandoz explorer - sometimes the search and waiting is the fun bit. |
|||||||||
|
YARGH 3T WIS
|
I pulled the trigger. As suspcious as the whole situation seemed, I ultimately didn't have as bad feeling about it after some E-mailing the guy as I did before. After I expressed some reservations with his money order request, he actually agreed to do it over Paypal (he had an account, but had never sold anything with it and thought it would be too much trouble to set up to receive funds). I'm not getting as great a deal as it seems -- when the watch was new, 3-4 years ago (I asked the people at Limes to send me some specs of manufacturing history of this model, so I was able to come to a pretty good estimate of its age) it sold for $600-$700. Factors like inflation, an improving reputation of the brand, slight improvements to the construction, a better strap (with a deployment) and a much weaker dollar all contribute to the price of this watch being nearly $1200 today. So instead of saying I got a $1200 watch for $400, you could go the other way say that I got a 4-year old $600 watch for $400. If you just factor in the weakened dollar and inflation, I'd say I got an $800 watch for $400, albeit a used one, and one with no box, no papers, and no known history. Which probably isn't far from what it should be (the seller did absorb the insured UPS and Paypal fees). Assuming I ever get it, of course, but I think that I will. And the pictures looked really good. In this sense, I don't think it as a case of "too good to be true" at all, but probably a pretty fair deal all around, considering the risk I assumed. For the time being, this looks like the only way I'm going to be buying Swiss or German watches -- the dollar/euro thing (which has been brought up on this forum before) is just making it cost-prohibitive (value-prohibitive, really) to buy them new. Perhaps a Russian will be the next acquisition. |
|||||||||
|
fliegerman 3T WIS
|
I'm glad it's working out ok. I really like most of the Limes watches. Be sure to post pics when you get it! regards, Dave |
|||||||||
|
DEMO Guest
|
Sometimes I agree, you have to be careful and try to find out about the seller. But as a seller I can sometimes understand why you would not want to use paypal. They take a bite out of your profit right off the top. Some sellers like to pocket all of their sale price. I just sold a watch using paypal and they just took $45.00 off the top of my profit on the watch. A seller has to price the watch that much higher so they don't get hit with that fee. Offering Paypal does make it easier to sell a watch if you want to put up with their fees and gives the buyer more confidence in the purchase. |
|||||||||
|
YARGH 3T WIS
|
Update on this transaction: Seller E-mailed me the UPS receipt with tracking number and an estimated delivery date of this previous Monday. No delivery on Monday; after nothing arrived yesterday, I called the local UPSstore that the item shipped from to find out what's up. The clerk there told me that there have been some problems with two items on "that particular truck;" more specifically: "they seem to have disappeared." They said they're working on locating it. Has this ever happened to anyone here? It looks like I will not be getting my watch. Hopefully, I can get my money back. It was a Paypal transaction -- what is the typical protocol for a reversal of funds -- just provide proof that it didn't arrive? This is very disheartening, as this was not a watch that normally appears for sale, and that was a pretty good price for it. Oh well. |
|||||||||
|
jsb806f Guest
|
Why do you assume the fault is with the seller? If UPS has a tracking number then the watched wasshipped by the seller. If it is "lost" or "stolen" after that why is it the seller's fault? Did you ask that the watch be insured? I'm not sure that PayPal will reimburse under these circumstances since it doesn't look like this is the seller's fault. I'd be going after UPS. |
|||||||||
|
YARGH 3T WIS
|
I'm not saying that it is the seller's fault. I'm saying that I bought something that I never received, and my receiving it is the seller's responsibility. I will take the money back from him; if he feels entitled to get *his* money back from UPS, more power to him. He arranged and paid for the shipping -- not me. If he was too cheap to use overnight or two-day service, that's his problem. |
|||||||||
|
KenC Admin
|
jsb806f wrote: Why do you assume the fault is with the seller? If UPS has a tracking number then the watched wasshipped by the seller. If it is "lost" or "stolen" after that why is it the seller's fault? Did you ask that the watch be insured? I'm not sure that PayPal will reimburse under these circumstances since it doesn't look like this is the seller's fault. I'd be going after UPS. I think you may have misread YARGH's comment...I see nothing that even implies that he is blaming the seller. He even stated that he verified the shipment with UPS and they admitted that they had possession of it and now could not locate it. Unless otherwise stated in the sale, it is the seller's responsibility to place insurance on the item being sold to protect against loss until it reaches the buyer. Delivery to a transit point does not constitute delivery to the purchaser. That said, only the seller can go after UPS as the contract is with the shipper and not the consignee...I just went thru that with FedEx |
|||||||||
|
jsb806f Guest
|
KenC wrote: jsb806f wrote:Why do you assume the fault is with the seller? If UPS has a tracking number then the watched wasshipped by the seller. If it is "lost" or "stolen" after that why is it the seller's fault? Did you ask that the watch be insured? I'm not sure that PayPal will reimburse under these circumstances since it doesn't look like this is the seller's fault. I'd be going after UPS. I read nothing in my original comment to suggest that I implied that Yargh was blaming the seller. I wrote that it sounded like UPS lost the watch not the seller and that I didn't think that PayPal would reimburse for that. I am not criticizing Yargh. The seller is responsible for insuring the item unless otherwise stated? Interesting. I would think the reverse is true. Unless otherwise stated in the ad the watch is not sent insured by the seller. Why should the seller automatically assume the cost of insuring an item? I have insured items that I have sold when asked to do so by the buyer. I don't think it is reasonable or wise for buyers to simply assume that sellers insure the item. That seems a little like assuming that unless otherwise stated in the ad that the seller will ship the watch overnight. Wouldn't it be safer for buyers to assume if it isn't in the ad it isn't being done? I know this is an awful situation for Yargh and I can sympathize with him. I hope everything works out to his advantage. The situation raises an interesting question about the responsibility of the seller once a watch has been shipped. Last edited on Thu Jun 5th, 2008 12:14 pm by |
|||||||||
|
Skipdawg 3T WIS
|
Bottom line it is between buyer and seller and the seller has to deal with the shipper (UPS) in this case for the buyer. I have a some what related matter right now. International shipment and package is either in the US Customs black hole or in a lost or stolen state. But when a claim is filed you just have to sit back and wait. Not much the buyer or seller can do untill they get word back from the shipper. |
|||||||||
|
jsb806f Guest
|
Skipdawg wrote: Bottom line it is between buyer and seller and the seller has to deal with the shipper (UPS) in this case for the buyer. So, when you sell a watch do you insure the watch as part of shipping or is that something extra that the seller must request? |
|||||||||
|
oagaspar Site Founder
|
Speaking as a Sr. WIS I don't ship anything without insuring it and adding delivery confirmation at my expense on any watch I sell which really isn't that much extra $ for peace of mind and to cover loss .;) I would be responsible and inclined as the seller to refund the buyer regardless of who lost it....it also insures it was received as the buyer must sign for ithand6.gif |
|||||||||
|
jsb806f Guest
|
oagaspar wrote: Speaking as a Sr. WIS I don't ship anything without insuring it and adding delivery confirmation at my expense on any watch I sell which really isn't that much extra $ for peace of mind and to cover loss .;) Speaking as a Novice WIS, sounds like good advice. Insurance doesn't cost that much anyway. |
|||||||||
|
KenC Admin
|
jsb806f wrote: KenC wrote:jsb806f wrote:Why do you assume the fault is with the seller? If UPS has a tracking number then the watched wasshipped by the seller. If it is "lost" or "stolen" after that why is it the seller's fault? Did you ask that the watch be insured? I'm not sure that PayPal will reimburse under these circumstances since it doesn't look like this is the seller's fault. I'd be going after UPS. Okay...maybe it was this line that threw me off when you asked him, "Why do you assume the fault is with the seller?". I, personally, assume it is the sellers responsibility to get the item you have purchased from him safely delivered to the purchaser. I know that if I shipped something and it did not get to the destination, I would feel responsible and make good. Obviously, my opinion and assumption is different than yours, but I think your analogy is way off...I automatically assume that the goods will be shipped the least expensive way possible unless otherwise stated. But none of this is worth arguing over, and I apologize if I misread your sentence! |
|||||||||
|
jsb806f Guest
|
KenC wrote: jsb806f wrote:KenC wrote:jsb806f wrote:Why do you assume the fault is with the seller? If UPS has a tracking number then the watched wasshipped by the seller. If it is "lost" or "stolen" after that why is it the seller's fault? Did you ask that the watch be insured? I'm not sure that PayPal will reimburse under these circumstances since it doesn't look like this is the seller's fault. I'd be going after UPS. Ken, Point taken. However, I don't think this is an argument as much as it is a discussion of best practice. :) If you buy a watch from me and you don't receive it, I would offer to refund your money to you. I think that is the ethical and honest thing to do. Fortunately I have never experienced this situation. I probably should insure what I ship for my own protection not the buyers as Oscar does. That is something I have learned from our discussion. Insurance isn't something to protect the buyer it is something to protect the seller! The closest I have come to this situation is a buyer not being happy with the item he bought. I offered to refund his money and paid shipping costs both ways. Again, I think that is the ethical and honest thing to do. |
|||||||||
|
KenC Admin
|
jsb806f wrote:
Then we are on the same wave length...I do insure packages that are going out that have a value in excess of $100...less than that, I take the risk and send with delivery confirmation only, but I do believe that it is my responsibility to see that the goods get to the purchaser safely. If they do not, then I believe, as you do, that the only ethical and responsible thing to do is to refund the buyer's money. And you are absolutely correct about the application of insurance! |
|||||||||
|
hucky 3T WIS 
|
What could go wrong in the Hands of the United Postal Service?  Great Topic nice points all the way around. Cheers |
|||||||||
|
Skipdawg 3T WIS
|
jsb806f wrote: oagaspar wrote:Speaking as a Sr. WIS I don't ship anything without insuring it and adding delivery confirmation at my expense on any watch I sell which really isn't that much extra $ for peace of mind and to cover loss .;) And as for me I have never sold a watch online. The few recent I parted with were with local friends and family and was a hand to hand deal. :cool: Back in the 90's I sold off about 40 quartz but did it on consignment at a local place. :) But when I do sell a watch online here at 3T shipping (USPS Priority), insurance and paypal fees will be on me. ;) |
|||||||||
|
YARGH 3T WIS
|
Update on this: UPS notified me yesterday that the package was located, and that it will now be on its way. The estimated delivery day is next Wednesday. That's 9 days after the original delivery date. I haven't even told the seller about the problems yet (I didn't want to nix the transaction until I was certain that the item was lost), but I think I will, because he probably deserves a refund from UPS. They refused to do anything on my end, like bump it up to a faster tier of delivery, and he's the one who paid, so I guess he's the one who should ge a refund or some form of compensation. No way that UPS should be able to keep all of the postage, though -- this was terrible service. |
|||||||||
|
jsb806f Guest
|
Wow! I've always had excellent service from UPS. Doesn't make sense that now they have found the package that it will take that long. I would think that UPS would next-day-deliver the item since they lost it originally. Seems like pooer CS to me. |
|||||||||
|
YARGH 3T WIS
|
Further update: watch arrived yesterday, in the exact condition as described by the seller. I know I ignored some potential red flags here, but my communications with the seller led me to believe that everything would turn out OK in the end, and thankfully it did. |
|||||||||
|
steve6387 3T WIS 
|
Good to hear that. Hope you enjoy the watch. As for myself, I got alot out of reading this post. being a mid-level WIS, with limited purchasing expereince this was a very good read. Even better knowing there is a happy ending! --Steve |
|||||||||
|
KenC Admin
|
Congrats on a happy ending...thankfully...it was more than a bar of soap!:D |
|||||||||
