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Dismounting a legend: 58mm Zlatoust Russian Diver  Rating:  Rating
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 Posted: Tue Nov 27th, 2012 05:38 pm
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SDREW
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Here is a larger pic of the interior of my Zlatoust, you'll see its brushed steel/alloy. I did a complete dismantle and cleaning and oiling of my movement too, so I've had a hands on view of the interior, even sanded a gouge down close to the tube.

Last edited on Tue Nov 27th, 2012 05:43 pm by SDREW

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 Posted: Tue Nov 27th, 2012 05:53 pm
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Hammerfjord
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I know very well that steel can be polished and look like that.
But after 40 years it's unlikely that the polishing is looking as bright as that: Forget it. This is old Russian steel: Not the best stainless you can find now.
So Mark Gordon is repolishing his polished watch cases before photographies?
There's nothing unreal about my model: Every details are closed to exactly like your model, except the case who's in nickeled brass. Just look the pictures again.
Yes, my movement is poor in jewels but it's exactly the same who was used by Zlatoust.
Now, you very much know that many diver cases was made from nickeled brass back in the time... But never in Russia ?
I bought mine from a collector in Switzerland who was claiming that the case was in polished steel: Wrong.
My straps is obviously a remake: I know how the originals looks like.
And a strap don't make a watch.
But if there is a thing I know: It's that no remake/imitation I ever seen is matching my watch. Even on the site of Mark Gordon.
I still don't have any answer from the Zlatoust factory but I will have it one day: Question is... Will you like it?

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 Posted: Tue Nov 27th, 2012 06:14 pm
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SDREW
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Yes, there are many cheaper dive models made from brass....but the issue is very simple, the brass Zlatoust is not dive proof.....the steel versions are dive proof to 300m. Many of the later Zlatousts were hardly used, also the underside of the watch being highly polished still is expected, it is against the skin of the wearer....not out in the elements....Zlatousts were not stainless steel, they were steel, nickel was used to stop rusting.

I can pull an example of yours, here is the exact same watch as yours!!

http://forums.watchuseek.com/f10/my-fake-zlatoust-experience-647026.html

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 Posted: Tue Nov 27th, 2012 06:31 pm
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SDREW
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Zlatoust is not at all affiliated with the old Zlatoust, that factory was destroyed and they no longer the same company...they will not have any information for you.

As for information given to me and me not liking it, I couldn't give a monkeys uncle on this, but here is a simple fact, all the brass ones came with the same paperwork, all had the non-radioactive paperwork and the same date(day, month and year) stamped on the paperwork too.

The difference between you and I on our purchase is simple, you were mislead by a seller and have resourced your information after the point of purchase, where as I educated myself before my purchase and took a calculated risk with my purchase, I got lucky and you didn't(depending on the price you paid, a nickel plated brass is worth $250-300 perhaps, the steel is worth $850-$2000)....My seller was Italian, he is in his 50's and the watch is from his fathers collection, his father just passed away two month ago. He had two Zlatoust, one his father purchased in the early 1970's and he also had another one his father purchased in the 1980's, the later was much heavier! My purchase was based on factual information on the Government issued Zlatousts, and its based on the weight being around 270grams, steel is lighter than brass, so I based my purchase on the lighter of the two and got the one his father purchased at an earlier date....

Also two sizes for Zlatoust, the earliest were 58mm and not 60mm.
The problem with brass is its soft, so to have a screw down bezel for waterproofing the case, well that is not going to hold up as the threading becomes worn very fast and also is easily bent. My Zlatoust is near impossible to unscrew and screw tight, I've had to custom make a part to tighten mine for waterproofing purposes.

I didn't come here to argue or be rude, I'm just a messenger of fact based information, it seems you are not interested in anything other than finding something that supports your view that the Zlatoust in your possession was a Soviet military issue item, which it was not....it is a Authentic Zlatoust made for the public, still a very cool time piece, just not the government issued one...be happy you didn't spend $1500 and find brass!

I've been collecting vintage for 22years, that's since the age of 15, I'm pretty knowledgeable and well connected, if I don't know something I can get the info.

I'm surprised you are so anti-Mark Gordon, seems odd to me that you would take the stance a man who has taken the time to dedicate a site to Russian/soviet issue timepieces, and has 5 versions of the watch we are talking about, is some how a not credible source and is in your eyes is not a credible source....what is the deal mate?

Last edited on Tue Nov 27th, 2012 06:51 pm by SDREW

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 Posted: Tue Nov 27th, 2012 06:31 pm
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Hammerfjord
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SDREW wrote:
Yes, there are many cheaper dive models made from brass....but the issue is very simple, the brass Zlatoust is not dive proof.....the steel versions are dive proof to 300m. Many of the later Zlatousts were hardly used, also the underside of the watch being highly polished still is expected, it is against the skin of the wearer....not out in the elements....Zlatousts were not stainless steel, they were steel, nickel was used to stop rusting.

I can pull an example of yours, here is the exact same watch as yours!!

http://forums.watchuseek.com/f10/my-fake-zlatoust-experience-647026.html

Yes, I agree it's like mine.
So, who made those ? Because like one of the guy said "Unfortunately, early "tourist divers" were apparently very similar to the original ones. I still think that they were "downgraded" versions, made with the same toolings. "

And that's what I was thinking myself...
As they match the originals except the brass case, I thought that the Zlatoust factory may have made those cheaper models during the crisis.
That's why I wanted an answer from Mr Fedotov at the factory.

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 Posted: Tue Nov 27th, 2012 06:58 pm
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SDREW
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And that's what I was thinking myself...
As they match the originals except the brass case, I thought that the Zlatoust factory may have made those cheaper models during the crisis.
That's why I wanted an answer from Mr Fedotov at the factory.

Your was made by Zlatoust, they made them at the end of the cold war, only for a year or two and then others started making more commercialized versions with the cheesy engravings on the dial and caseback....even some have a sub dial with seconds hand. There is a black finished one that comes up here and there, Mark actually knew the name of it, the SHARK....is the translation from Russian.

Sorry if anything I've said is coming off as me being RUDE, its one of the problems with discussions over the web, typed communications are very dry and can come off harsher than intended.

I will source more info for you and post it, it will be a great tool for everyone!

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 Posted: Tue Nov 27th, 2012 06:59 pm
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Hammerfjord
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SDREW wrote:
Zlatoust is not at all affiliated with the old Zlatoust, that factory was destroyed and they no longer the same company...they will not have any information for you.

As for information given to me and me not liking it, I couldn't give a monkeys uncle on this, but here is a simple fact, all the brass ones came with the same paperwork, all had the non-radioactive paperwork and the same date(day, month and year) stamped on the paperwork too.

The difference between you and I on our purchase is simple, you were mislead by a seller and have resourced you information after the point of purchase, where as I educated myself before my purchase and took a calculated risk with my purchase....My seller was Italian, he is in his 50's and the watch is from his fathers collection, his father just passed away two month ago, he had this one his father purchased in the early 1970's and he also had another one his father purchased in the 1980's, the later was much heavier! The purchase was based on factual information on the Government issued Zlatousts, and its based on the weight 270grams, steel is lighter than brass, so I based my purchase on the lighter of the two and got the one his father purchased at an earlier date....

Also two sizes for Zlatoust, the earliest were 58mm and not 60mm.
The problem with brass is its soft, so to have a screw down bezel for waterproofing the case, well that is not going to hold up.

I didn't come here to argue or be rude, I'm just a messenger of fact based information, it seems you are not interested in anything other than finding something that supports your view that the Zlatoust in your possession was a Soviet military issue item, which it was not....it is a Authentic Zlatoust made for the public, still a very cool time piece, just not government issue.


Mine is also 58mm as well.
I had done some research as well but I got a brass case. Mine weigh 297.2 grams with the huge strap/buckle I have.
It certainly would match closely your 270 grams of approval without the straps: The leather is 3mm thick and still when going in the loop, it could fit a 9cm diameter wrist.
At list I didn't pay the price of an original steel model: Or even not the half of it.
As if it's a public issue: It certainly is. But I wasn't ready to pay the original price and got this one on an auction.
Thanks for the info!
ThumbsUp02.gif

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 Posted: Tue Nov 27th, 2012 07:10 pm
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Hammerfjord
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SDREW wrote:
And that's what I was thinking myself...
As they match the originals except the brass case, I thought that the Zlatoust factory may have made those cheaper models during the crisis.
That's why I wanted an answer from Mr Fedotov at the factory.


Your was made by Zlatoust, they made them at the end of the cold war, only for a year or two and then others started making more commercialized versions with the cheesy engravings on the dial and caseback....even some have a sub dial with seconds hand. There is a black finished one that comes up here and there, Mark actually knew the name of it, the SHARK....is the translation from Russian.

Sorry if anything I've said is coming off as me being RUDE, its one of the problems with discussions over the web, typed communications are very dry and can come off harsher than intended.

I will source more info for you and post it, it will be a great tool for everyone!


No problem: I get it. Thanks for the precisions.

I also have a 50mm titanium Shark: It's not a Zlatoust of course.
By the way, Mr Fedotov from Zlatoust was very quick to respond on this one when I asked what it was:
Приветствуем Вас!

Вы писали 19 сентября 2012 г.:
It is NOT Zlatoust watch!

-----
B/R Fedotov Sergey
info@agatfactory.com


Still, I love it...


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